Donnie Darko
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donnie never dreamt about frank and gretchen, unless you consider everything that happened in the "tangent universe" a dream. then in that case, he dreamt about his mother, father, sisters, frank, gretchen, cherita and so on. so um, yeah, way to relly on supplimental material to a movie and form an invalid conclusion.
>>By someday it will all make sense (Wednesday, 10 Sep 2003 07:47)
Umm..you are retarded...if you actually were a dork like me and obessed over interviews with the director...read every single piece of literature having to do with the movie and read every single article and website about it...then you would know that even though Frank is more obvious and persistant...he dreams about Grethcen too...and she helps him find the way! Freak show!
>>By Catty (Thursday, 11 Sep 2003 00:58)
ok, well, obviously being wrong is one of your strong points, as well as using an elipsis (which is used for an omission) instead of a comma (which is used as a pause). fortunately, i'm not a "dork" like you.
at this time, i'm going to address some things wrong with your posts (relative to the movie).
1. donnie doesn't dream about frank and gretchen in the movie. the only time you could make anything close to a conclusion that he dreams about frank is during the therapy session while he's under hypnosis. nowhere in the final cut of the movie does he dream about gretchen (or in the deleted scenes for that matter).
2. wow, you found out why grandma death was waiting by the mail box. "she understands time travel." MAYBE BECAUSE SHE WROTE THE BOOK ABOUT IT. brilliant deduction einstein.
on another note, you say that gretchen and frank weren't meant to die, that's why they were so influential to him, blah blah blah, manipulated dead, blah blah blah. ok, well, assuming that you've seen everything on the site, then i'm sure that you read about how grandma death, dr. monitoff, jim cunningham, and someone else (frankly, i can't remember who) die. so why is it, that these people (influential as well) die in the real world after donnie dies. honestly, it seems like the better thing to die in the "tangent universe", because those that did, ended up living in the real universe. just something to think about.
so in conclusion, you were wrong (relative to the movie). sure, maybe donnie dreams about gretchen in a book somewhere, or in some directors commentary, but the point remains. IT WASN'T IN THE MOVIE. and if you're going to make a claim, that which, according to the movie is not true, AT LEAST BACK IT UP WITH SOME EVIDENCE. i mean, that's like me saying that, "Donnie is a hermaphrodite. Sure it wasn't in the movie, but I read it somewhere."
the only thing that was decent about anything that you said was the skull in the eye thing. yes, it was a good visual metaphor for "seeing death," nicely done.
and on that last note, i'm done. write back more so i can prove you wrong. i enjoy it.
>>By someday it will all make sense (Thursday, 11 Sep 2003 07:06)
Hey all, only on page 9 of this (lot of damn reading heh), need to sleep now, but wanted to get this in. Seen the movie twice, no I havent been to the website yet or watched any of the special features (fun for tommorow).
Ony thing I wanted to shoot in: Any thoughts/info on Eddie's (the father) comment on "donnie is doomed" when talking to Rose about that boy dieing on the way to prom?
>>By Trent_Alkaline (Thursday, 18 Sep 2003 14:17)
i just thought, maybe dead frank is still there telling donnie to come outside at the end of the movie? and because donnie has no intention of going outside and instead is accepting his death, he laughs. i know i laugh when someone tells me to do something and i don't. i know frank is in his room and you see him but dead frank still exists somehow because, well he died. sure it's not in the primary universe but it still happened. well, just a thought. no need to shoot me down.
>>By muffin (Friday, 26 Sep 2003 13:18)
I've spent a good amount of time ni the past 24 hours reading all the posts. I think I might have an original take on the ending.
What if Donnie doesn't actually die? Let's say that after all his experiences in the tangent universe he continues sleep-walking (remember he did this before he met Frank) and he's not in his room. Knowing that this would lead to the eventual death of his loved ones (and Frank), he dreams that he is in bed and that he dies. Remember the Mad World song at the end saying "The dreams in which I'm dying are the best I ever had". It might be a bit out there but so's the whole movie isn't it?
Also, do Donnie's mother and sister actually die? I mean if by guiding the engine back into the primary universe Donnie ends the tangent universe, then the plane doesn't actually crash, it's just about too, when the tangent world ceases to exist. If they didn't died they weren't Manipulated Dead. If they did die then that means that they were Manipulated Dead and that the tangent world continued to exist for a while. When did the tangent world end?
>>By Seemoni (Friday, 26 Sep 2003 18:58)
Let me start with the general theory which most of the people agreed on, it’s about a boy who got some super natural powers that enabled him to control the time-space dimension. We start the movie with engine falling from the sky on boy’s bed; however the boy wasn’t on the bed because he was warned by frank which came from the future to guide him to a certain path. According to the philosophy of time travel, frank is a manipulated dead who is suppose to guide Donnie to the path which he must take, along with frank we have Gretchen Ross which is also a manipulated dead.
The 4th dimension which is time, was some how modified to create a tangent that connect different regions of time curve, if this tangent wasn’t canceled within a certain time, the universe will collapse. The engine which crushed on the bed at the first time of the movie was a result of the of this time modification, although the airplane accident happened at the end of the movie in the modified time dimension, however the engine felt backward in the time tangent using Donnie’s powers, but I don’t think that only the engine went backward in the time tangent but the whole time went backward on itself, so at the end we were able to pass the time modification ( which can be viewed according to this theory, an error in time dimension).
So, all the people were manipulated somehow to guide the receiver (Donnie) to save the universe using his power to correct the error in the time dimension.
But my friends, the truth is not that simple; the above theory forced the word god into the discussion, who created the error in the time dimension? Who manipulated the people to guide Donnie to correct in the tangent time? Everything was arranged so smoothly A To B, B to C, C to D to guide Donnie to the path, everyone did his part so well frank, the teaches, his girl friend, his parents, everyone, who is controlling all this? So personally I wasn’t satisfied.
I think the best word to describe the time modification is mutation; time was mutated due to the present of certain circumstances at that instant, the result is modification in shape of time. When the time is modified all the law of physics are also must be modified I believe, in other world, it’s no longer the same world we live in. I don’t think the same physics laws are going to hold in mutated time dimension, since almost everything is defined by the law of physics, even the way you think, the way you see, the way you talk, everything my friends, is result of four universal forces. Now, once mutation has occurred, the results could be very surprising, new forces could be formed, new laws can be formulated, and illogical things from our universe point of view can turn to be logical in the new tangent universe. This is how I explain the ability to visualize future vectors of humans by Donnie.
Back to the movie, I think Donnie was sick person in the original universe. He spent most of his time in daydreaming, due to the high level of theta radiation in his brain. He is very smart but lonely person, he is scared of being alone. And that is nature behavior, we all need to belong to a group this is the way genetics tells us to be. He never had a girl friend I suppose, he sad and angry. During our depressed friend Donnie life, time mutation took place, the whole laws are changed and new forces have been formed. In the new mutated tangent universe our friend Donnie has the perfect mind conditions (which were considered to be sick in the original universe) to control the new forces. According to the movie, it seems there is a strong connection between the nerve cells in the brain and a new force in the tangent force than can manipulate the time. It seems to me from the movie that the human psychology remained fixed. However, we were introduced with a new form of forces (Spirit like), it seems that when a person dies in the new tangent universe, his character doesn’t disappear from the life scenario, instead he will take a form of energy and travel in 4th dimension. Here I would like to ask, why those new forces (such as frank) is helping Donnie to cancel the tangent world. An easy answer will be god said so( But that is not satisfactory asnwer for me). I think to answer this we need to have knowledge of the psychology of those forces, based on their behavior in the movie, I assume that those forces has 1- An Insight in the time dimension 2- A love to be back to life. Why do they have that aspect of behavior? Is the same as asking we do we feel hungry? So with their insight on the 4th dimension they were able to touch the new Donnie powers in the tangent universe, so to satisfy the requirement of being a life, they decided to use Donnie’s power to cancel the tangent universe and go back to life. Its very similar to the current human life, during a period of starvation in a village, everyone would like to be a friend with the rich farmer who got a lot of food, why is that? Because we are designed to follow our natural genetics.
Look at Gretchen Ross in the movie, every thing she did was to guide Donnie to the path of canceling the tangent universe, we she first sat next to him in the class, we she asked him to walk her home, we she kissed him, slept him with, the connection between them grew stronger, as if she knew that she is going to die in the new universe, until we reach the end, and she dies in the tangent universe, our poor Donnie is alone again , he we so prepared by her to rewind the time. So I say the new force did her job so well in the tangent universe. Frank actions were more obvious and his influence on Donnie was clear.
Is Donnie a hero who saved the universe? I don’t know think so, the only one who benefit from the tangent experience in this movie, is Donnie himself. Donnie who was a sick, lonely person in the real world, who was about to die in his bed with sorrow and pain, was able at the end of the movie to die while smiling and he had a wonderful experience However the rest of the world, don’t know anything about the tangent universe. And what Donnie did was nothing more than following the path of freedom from his loneness with the guide of the manipulated forces in the tangent universe. He didn’t rewind the time for the sake of human race, no. Its because of his experience in the tangent world, the love, the pain, friendship and the powers he experienced in the tangent universe.
Thank you for reading this, I apologize for the poor english, and I open for any argument :)
Ali
>>By Gilgamesh (Monday, 29 Sep 2003 00:23)
I don't think anyone mentioned this, but towards the start of the movie when everyone is in school and the two bullies are doing drugs at the lockers, some male teacher walks by and seems to smile when he sees them.
Its not really important. but it adds to the "corruptness" of the school.
>>By A bloody fetus (Monday, 29 Sep 2003 21:54)
The site says Patrick Swayze kills himself when the universes normalize. obviously because he is so afraid of his porn dungeon and knows he will be found out since he has fore-seen it and taught a lesson by god. so he dies near the start of the movie.
>>By A bloody fetus (Monday, 29 Sep 2003 23:37)
"I don't think anyone mentioned this, but towards the start of the movie when everyone is in school and the two bullies are doing drugs at the lockers, some male teacher walks by and seems to smile when he sees them."
Whoops, I dont mean teacher, I was meaning the PRINCIPLE, the same person who fired donnies teachers.
>>By A bloody fetus (Tuesday, 30 Sep 2003 09:20)
An Attempt At Indexing All 19 Pages
---
This Is For You If:
you don't want to sound like a fool who didn't do research before
posting something mentioned in the earlier pages.
---
Note: Many of the users have posted more than once on the same
page, so for example if a user 'A' is referenced to page '4' and (s)he
posted twice, just do some reading and track it down. Inversely,
sometimes one post touches more than one category and so they're
doubly referenced.
If you're using IE hit Ctrl+F and run a search within the page for the
word(s).
---
Jamuraan first mentions the terminology derived from Sparrow's book
The Philosophy of Time Travel (Living Receiver, Manipulated Living, etc)
and recommended www.donniedarko.com
---
CONTENTS (not arranged at all, recklessly random)
1: Destiny Theme
2: Production Notes + News
3: 28 Days, 6 Hours, 42 Minutes
4: Website-Related
5: Primary Universe, Tangent Universe, 4th Dimension, Artifact, etc
6: All Things God-Related
7: All Things Donnie Jesus Related
8: Donnie And The Science Teacher (or just "Both Teachers")
9: The Theatre, Donnie, Frank and Gretchen
10: Placebos
11: Roberta Sparrow
12: "Deus Ex Machina" (what Donnie whispered to the guy with the knife)
13: Donnie Laughing At The End - Why Oh Why Oh Why...
14: Various Characters Montage At The End
15: Frank is Donnie's Sister's Boyfriend and Other Things
16: Donnie Darko The SuperHero
17: Deleted Scenes
18: Cherita, aka "The Chinese Girl" + Earmuffs
19: Jet Engine as an Artifact
20: Gretchen
21: Homages/References to Other Movies, Books etc
22: The Guy In Red
23: Long Posts That I'm Too Lazy To Categorise
24: Cellar Door
25: Cunningham/ Patrick Swayze
---
1
Destiny theme:
pg 2, John
pg 4, Kelvin formerly known as someunconfusedguy
pg 6, Kelvin
2
Production Notes (possibly, not sure, but sounds like it) + News
pg 2, aeroslash
pg 13, B
3
28 days, 6 hours, 42 minutes
pg 2, Kate (brings up HGG reference etc)
pg 2, Kate (further down the page, explains HGG reference)
pg 12, kagegod
4
Website-Related (www.donniedarko.com)
pg 2, Bishop (if you're stuck at level 2 - golfcourse)
pg 4, mm (tells mahalia that she's stuck at lvl 3 because that's where it
ends)
pg 11, GOD (For the text of The Philosophy of Time Travel that's easier on the eyes)
pg 14, darks_fear (all the passwords, for the truly lazy)
5
Primary Universe, Tangent Universe, 4th dimension, Artifact, etc
pg 2, someunconfusedguy
pg 2, Bishop
pg 4, Bishop (can't understand how 4th dimensional rift occured)
pg 4, Inanna (attempts analogy to answer Bishop's question)
pg 5, and by (what takes place in Tangent and Primary)
pg 8, Subtillus
pg 10, dyloniousphunk
pg 10, Bishop (what caused the alternate reality)
pg 12, laughingstock
pg 15, TimandDrew
pg 16, Sausage Fingers
pg 18, mysterfxit
pg 18, mettler
pg 18, someday it will all make sense
6
All Things God-Related
pg 2, someunconfusedguy
pg 3, inanna "definitely a theme of God?/no God?/nature of God?"
pg 4 and by (on whether God did it to teach people a lesson per se)
pg 4 someunconfused guy (again, destiny, Jesus, sacrifice, the works)
pg 9, Team Billy
pg 13, Dexter
pg 14, Kelvin
7
All Things Donnie-Jesus Related
pg 2, Alora
pg 3, i dont have a name ("The Last Temptation of Christ")
pg 7, dxkj@hotmail.com
8
Donnie And The Science Teacher (or just 'Both Teachers')
pg 2, West ("ST said if you knew your path and visualised it, it would be
a form of time travel")
pg 2, Bishop ("more to that guy that meets the eye, as well as his wife")
pg 3, someunconfusedguy (ST "didn't believe in god")
pg 9, Subtillus
pg 9, Gildeth (a bit about barrymore)
pg 9, Wallaby
pg 18, WildDealer
9
The Theatre, Donnie, Frank and Gretchen
pg 2, Kate
pg 3, Bishop ("why are you wearing that mansuit" comment)
pg 18, Audrey
10
Placebos
pg 2, Kate
11
Roberta Sparrow (as a Living Receiver, life story theories etc)
pg 2, Bishop ("that's why she left and wrote the book overnight")
pg 7, Kelvin
pg 7, Mahalia
pg 10, rogue
pg 10, laxonite (answers topdog's question on what Sparrow whispered to Donnie)
pg 11, dosangh
pg 12, bob the slob
pg 13, Jay
pg 15, maladroit
pg 16, dewby
pg 16, Mandelbrotjulia
pg 18, WildDealer
12
"Deus Ex Machina" (what Donnie whispered to the guy with the knife)
pg 2, someunconfusedguy
pg 2, digiwizzard
pg 3, Inanna ("machine of the gods...")
pg 5, Then ("a character or single even that turns the whole tide of
the movie")
pg 5, McKenzie ("Um, sorry, no." God from the machine and refers to
Greek playwrights trick)
pg 6, drummer ("stage device in which a god appeared to resolve a
plot")
pg 12, Kitaro
pg 13, Cinnamon Girl (with reference to Being John Malkovich and Adaptation)
13
Donnie Laughing At The End - Why Oh Why Oh Why...
pg 3, Bishop (off-putting mood)
pg 3, Bishop (simplisticity-related)
pg 4, Andrew C (realises unity of universe)
pg 4, and by (effectively travelled and is enlightened)
pg 5, Seraphim (offers two reasons)
pg 5, Suspiria (he remembers everything and feels he's won)
pg 5, Inanna (existentialist joke that life can be)
pg 6, Fez (content in sacrificing himself so he doesn't die alone)
pg 7, Andrew C (because it's one big joke)
pg 7, Kitty (for no reason at all)\
pg 7, Subtillus (saw the mind of God, sky opening, replacing unhappiest
memory)
pg 9, muffin (facing death and something to do with gretchen
mentioning something)
pg 9, mazda (laughs in the face of adversity, like crying when you're really happy)
pg 9, gildeth (irony behind the situation)
14
Various Characters Montage At The End
pg 3, Inanna (level of awareness and reaction/ability to deal with it)
15
Frank is Donnie's Sister's Boyfriend and Other Things
pg 3, Alora (answering j's question about why the cop cars arrive)
pg 8, "Remember everything, when only memories remain".
pg 8, Subtillus
pg 13, B
pg 14, GrimlyFiend (when he sounds the horn before Donnie dies)
pg 14, Dolly Dagger
pg 18, Dubbya
16
Donnie Darko The SuperHero
pg 3, the motor ace crayon
pg 4, Alora (wonders about the hood act)
pg 4, and by (answers that the director was going for comic book
superhero feel)
pg 7, Subtillus
pg 17, Daniel ("change things" said twice)
17
Deleted Scenes
pg 3, Kate (mention of the poem Donnie reads)
pg 5, Then (Frank says "God loves his children. God loves you.")
pg 7, Andrew C (doctor explains to Donnie that his pills are placebos)
pg 14, Jay (Drew explains deus ex machina)
pg 14, Kelvin ("my saviour")
18
Cherita, aka "The Chinese Girl" + Earmuffs
pg 4 (4 in a row) : Then, Inanna, Alora, someunconfusedguy (with a
cool theory about the earmuffs)
pg 7, Subtillus (represents isolation and desire for truth)
pg 9, Subtillus (no hope situation more than ignorance)
pg 11, grimlyfiendish
pg 14, darks_fear
pg 14, GrimlyFeindish
19
Jet Engine as an Artifact
pg 4, someunconfusedguy ("He used his fourth dimensional powers
(telekenisis) to send the jet engine back in time to kill himself")
pg 4, then
pg 4, Bishop (a nutshell summary included, universe, intervention, etc)
pg 4, then (thinking the jet engine was in some junkyard)
pg 4, Alora
pg 4, Kelvin (jet engine is from plane with Donnie's mom in it)
pg 6, an act of god
pg 7, blackberry
pg 9, pappa smurf (see point no. 2)
pg 10, DBlade
pg 10, TopDog
pg 13, Macca1960
20
Gretchen
(she's referenced a lot but mainly in a secondary manner)
pg 9, orphex
pg 9, mazda
pg 9, pappa smurf (in relation to smurfette in smurf story)
pg 11, grimly fiendish
pg 11, rogue
pg 13, Macca1960
pg 14, truthquest
21
Homages/References to Other Movies, Books etc
pg 7, the curious orange
pg 8, Daulphin (lorry driver in Graham Greene book)
pg 12, Matt (Donnie's costume the same as Elliot's in ET)
pg 12, laughingstock (Back to the Future)
22
The Guy In Red
pg 5, Alora (Richard Kelly says he's actually from the FAA)
23
Long Posts That I'm Too Lazy To Categorise
pg 6, drummer
pg 8, t e c (involves cherita)
pg 10, getit
pg 11, kip
pg 12, CR
pg 13, Granto
pg 13, Granto (again)
pg 14, truthquest
pg 19, Gilgamesh
24
Cellar Door
pg 7, Inanna
pg 7, Mahalia (drawn to it because of Karen Pomeroy's meaning)
pg 10, laxonite
pg 13, B
pg 15, cellar door
25
Cunningham/ Patrick Swayze
pg 7, Subtillus
pg 15, rickeygee
pg 19, a bloody fetus
---
I know I've missed out a LOT of posts but I feel on the verge of exploding at the moment, this is my first post here and quite likely my last. But since this thing already exists, two things can happen to it, one, it'll actually be referred to and added to as time passes, or two, it'll be forgotten, and at the moment I couldn't quite care which will happen and which won't. Goodnight.
- Feirith Li
>>By feirith li (Friday, 3 Oct 2003 17:55)
I have been viewing this page for a while, and have wanted to comment but i didnt have time to register.
I have actually read everything. Before I did, though, I had YET ANOTHER theory. I have thrown it out just to get to sleep at night, because it leaves so much unexplained.
Do you notice that Frank always appears to Donnie right after he takes his medication? I thought that they overdosed him, and that caused hallucinations. The first time I watched it, when the mom agrees with Dr Thurman that they should up Donnie's dose, i was shouting "NO!!! DON'T!
Thank you all for pointing out things that I never would have caught (the skull at the end, the painting in cunningham's house, etc.)
there are many times in the movie where you see objects that look like the poster of the eye with donnie's lamp in front of it. I challenge you to look for this next time you view the movie. Sometimes it's just the horizontal light and sometmes it's just the eye.
>>By PointilISM (Tuesday, 7 Oct 2003 03:03)
DISCLAIMER:
this is my own interpretation, and, as I will say later, all opinions are valid here. I'm not trying to knock any ideas.
Ok, first of all, I have read most of the pages here in about three hours, but missed a chunk of them in the middle of the discussion. I think the big point that everyone is trying really hard to ignore is that this film has no definate answers. The 'Donnie's Dream Theory,' the whole 'Tangent Universe Theory,' and even some of the more far fetched, metaphorical ideas all have substantual evidence to make them credible. I think that the big point is not how time travel happens, but that Kelly is making a comment on existantialism with this movie. I have not seen the DVD with all the deleted scenes, director's commentary, etc, but I think that to understand a flim like this you have to be able to take it as it has been given to you, and all the information you need is in the film itself, not all the irrelevant background information, like how Jim Cunningham commits suicide in the 'Primary Universe.'
I think that Donnie is given a choice in bed at the end of the movie, and he chooses to die to save Gretchen and Frank from dying; also his English teacher from losing her job (because the flooding caused Graeme Green's book to be deemed partly responsible ). I think that HOW he is given the choice is irrelevant, and open to interpretation. Personally, I think that it's all a vision, despite the whole Living receiver, Manipulated Dead/Living, Tangent/Primary Universed, etc. Donnie chooses to die, but realizes, after the vision, that he will not die alone, because, as Dr Thurman said "it would be just you and your memories," but his memories are enough to give him happiness. He knows that he is staying "in God's path" when he stays in bed, and therefore prooves God to exist, so does not die alone.
Steve Mathardi obviously knows what he's talking about, and I would be interested to hear what he has to say about my post (hope I don't get shot down) but ultimatly I think the film is about the search for God/meaning/happiness - whatever - existantialism and therefore concentrates on themes and ideas rather than the Scientific plot of time travel.'peace' (thanks Mathardi)
>>By Beef (Friday, 10 Oct 2003 23:14)
Holy Crap - biblical references galore!!!
Jim Cunningham - J.C. - Jesus Christ - anyone agree??
I'm not sure if anyone's still posting here except me now, but I think that's pretty profound :)
J.C.
also because Frank appears after medication, it supports idea that they are placebo's (not real pills), and you don't need to go to the site, or see deleted scenes to get that. I still think this is a theme driven movie, not plot.
Please anyone email me with ideas/comments/arguaments, etc at beefthing@hotmail.com
Please email!
>>By Beef (Sunday, 12 Oct 2003 00:47)
hey did anyone else notice jim cunningham pat that kids ass in the second motivational vieo just before donnie insults mrs farmer? is this just a brief glimpse of cunninghams paedofile tendencies or just a meaningless piece of the film?
>>By ant (Sunday, 12 Oct 2003 03:21)
notice the rabbit head jacko lantern type thing to the left of the screen just after donnie opens the fridge with the message "frank was here went to get beer" ???
>>By ant (Sunday, 12 Oct 2003 03:47)
what exactly is it that donnie says while seth is on top of him?
something about ".....saviour"? anyone?
>>By ant (Sunday, 12 Oct 2003 03:51)
Decent movie
>>By noise_conspiracy (Monday, 13 Oct 2003 17:05)
Best debut film by a film-maker since Citizen Kane. I can't believe so many people are stuck on the obvious plot points in this film. There are so many small hints throughout the film including the placement of the music (chosen specifically for the lyrics, and feel of each scene) and the spiral on the end of the engine. Small stuff like that makes this movie an instant classic. It is a fully realized film and not one detail was left to chance. Richard Kelley has done his research on chaos theory and the spirals (the wormholes, the spiral on the engine, etc...) that make up our reality. They keys to this movie are contained within Gretchen, Ms. Death, Cherita, and (especially)Drew Berrymore's characters. Don't write off Drew's character, she is the key to the whole film. Figure out their significance and the story falls into place. Some people complain that there is no message to the movie. The message that I get is that sometimes you have to tear things down in order to build them back even stronger. There is order to the seemingly random chaos surrounding us. Donnie realizes how to see the order of chaos and, as the 'chosen reciever' of this knowledge, is able to make things right.
>>By Minds Eye (Wednesday, 22 Oct 2003 00:12)
This isn't a difficult synopsis.
Everyone dies alone.
Some times the answers are right in your face.
Dispite what any one says, or what new and previously unrevealed information surfaces, the conclusion is simple, and is the only real constant in the script.
>>By sans.subsistence (Monday, 3 Nov 2003 21:41)
ok well after reading about a hundred of all your different thoughts and interpretations i can truly say that this is the greatest movie i have ever seen. never has any other film produced so many thoughts about the same two hours of acting. i think i've just about sussed out the film and most of the pieces sort of slot into place. something i haven't seen mentioned yet is how all the programs the darkos watch on tv are always "recorded". is this another way of signalling that donnie is in the tangent universe? sorry if i'm just repeating something which has been said. finally, i only saw the movie about a month ago and have since tried to access the official website. i can get past level one but i can't actually get onto level two. i know the password is breathe but i can't enter it anywhere. please please help because i've read that there are explanations about noah wyle's character and a phone conversation between some people. i'm obviously clutching at straws because i don't really want to spoil the site if i ever manage to access it. so anyway could someone give me an explanation for why the site isn't working. thank you and long live the darko
>>By papalazorou (Monday, 3 Nov 2003 23:36)
I have read and thoroughly enjoyed a bunch of the theories elaborated on in this forum...here are my thoughts on certain aspects of the film that might spark some new ideas:
Grandma Death was a nun who converted to scientology after discovering time travel...primarily bringing up the discussion of the human soul deciding between religion and science - this idea will revolve back at the end of this paragraph - there is a more subtle and deeper idea here. Sparrow is walking back and forth in front of her mailbox looking in to see if her mail has arrived. She is obviously following the "path" she sees and seeing her future since she discovered that method of time travel. First of all, did she know that Donnie was going to write her a letter and was therefore following her timeline back and forth in front of the mailbox? Was Donnie's choice to write her a letter predetermined in HIS path? Sparrow's presence in the scene where Gretchen dies is critical to the film. Since one of the ideas revolving in the movie and in the forums is religion, let us assume for sake of discussion that all of these things needed to happen in order for a higher power to show Donnie his importance to these people's lives. Since everyone had to be in their right place, was Grandma Death really seeing her future or was she following God's path to help Donnie "see the light" persay? If this is the case, then theoretically everything would have a predetermined path and nobody would be able to choose their fate...furthermore (going along with this tangent) if "time travel" was really a predetermined path of God, could you theoretically consider the book that Sparrow wrote a religious book? Finishing this tangent, if all the previous are assumed, then can we say that science is derived from religion and boils down to belief and faith? I am not a particularly religious person myself and believe in evolution, but I thought it was an interesting idea.
Someone earlier in the forum mentioned the picture of Jim Cunningham in his house...my thought is that his ego forced him to display that enormous picture of himself in his house...consider this picture, then, a tangible representation of his ego. Now consider the fact that his kiddie porn was hidden in the room behind his picture. Therefore, he was hiding his dark secrets behind his large ego. Donnie also called J.C. the "antichrist". Was this because he could read beyond J.C.'s sales pitches (evangelism?) J.C. had the entire town supporting him and willing to follow his instruction. Compare this to religion. Was Donnie denouncing modern religion and promoting spiritualism? When J.C. was sent to prison and commited suicide (crucifixion?) there were many people who continued to believe his ideas and philosophies (the bitch who ran Sparkle Motion for example)....can this be compared to modern religion? Just a thought.
Please continue these delightful insights and I look forward to continuing this discussion with all of you. Thanks.
>>By GoldenChild88Elements (Thursday, 6 Nov 2003 01:01)
Where the hell did Drew Barrymores Flower Power Compnay get such a GREAT SCRIPT!
I have watched it 3 times and still I don't get one bit. I love the scene where they discuss the sexuality of the smurfs.
This movie was so warped but the official website is more weird I recomend that you all visit.
>>By kudos (Monday, 10 Nov 2003 02:33)
Ok after watching it ONCE it was so simple to see. Donnie was killed at the start when the engine fell on his room. Thats it. Then rest of the movie is just a dream he is having or a afterlife sessions just to let him continue with his life. So basically none of its real so it wouldnt matter if this universe or that primary this because its all in his head or someones head. Thats why nothign makes sense. Do dreams ever make sense? Mayby he was given this small month legnth after life to show him how it was to be hurt, loved. When the get back to the normal life at the end, where he is laughing. He is laughing because he called his mom a bitch. I am postive that scene where he is laughing is from before he dies, there for before he even has this dream/afterlife. SO he couldnt be laughing at that. Its so simple. He couldnt of stopped it, he wasnt being a savior or killing him self to save the world. he had 28 days to live his other life. If you notice, just about every scene in the movie is from another movie or a famous person. e.g when they are jumping on the trampoline, that comes from some famous photograph. The directors seemed to say hey lets make this movie where we can put whatever and trip everyone out. The part where Donnie is in his after life/dream IS NOT MEANT TO MAKE SENSE AT ALL. Thats the whole point. THe directors could make it weird so they did. "Hey lets put a scene from ET in it, and then make it sound like its Bak to the Future" It was lieka morcory of all 80's movies..mayby thats why it was set in the 80's?! SO yer basically, all this crap about primary universe and jesus. What matters. He was just having a dream/afterlife experience that lasted 28 days. It has nothign to do with the first scene when he is at home and the last few scenes where he is back in his bedroom. He was going to die simple. Think about it. If they had put the scene at the end where he is laughing and the engine falls on his room, if thye had put that at the start, instead of the scene where is called by Frank out of his bed, everything would of made sense., He was lying in bed and laughing about something and boom and engine fell on him. It just confuses people because they put this whole dream sequence in between to make people think WTF is going on. What does this mean. Etc . OK there u go
finished
hope you get it!
>>By BbZzDd (Friday, 14 Nov 2003 00:48)
Why would he laugh at calling his mom a bitch if he was feeling regret at doing it in the first place?
The ones close to Donnie remembered what happened in the Tangent universe, thats why jim killed himself and its also why frank touched his eye at the end of the film.
>>By A bloody fetus (Sunday, 16 Nov 2003 02:17)
I have a comment on the theater part of the movie, when frank mentions "why are you wearing that mansuit?" to Donnie.
Orthers have posted what they think of this part, but to me it seems obvious Donnie is wearing a "mansuit" because he is supposed to be dead. Frank has a bunny suit because of halloween.
Its funny that donnie has a skeleton suit for halloween, Im sure that has to do with it.
>>By A bloody fetus (Sunday, 16 Nov 2003 02:30)
OK I just watched the commented version of Donnie of DVD. It explains everything. He even says he is a different world thats not reality. That he is in a dream. He explains the laugh and everything. Why do people keep asking questions like why is he laughing or is the guy in the red suit donnie. You should all watch the commented version by the Kelly and Jake and it explains everything. Who means what when etc. It was all a dream
>>By BbZzDd (Monday, 17 Nov 2003 01:47)
Just for the people who dont know
The girl who played donnies sister is Jakes sister in real life!
The reason why the two teachers where laughing was because they knew there was somethign strange going on with donnie. Thats all. You can see the letter in Grandma deaths hand as franks is driving towards Gretchen in the end. Yes donnies sister is going out with frank. The bunny rabbitorange pumkin face you see in the kitchen is fromt the deleted scene. Donnie and his sister are carving pumkins, yet donnie seems to carve that. The reason why Frank beeped at the end and the start after he drops of Donnies sister, is according to the director and Jake, is to let donnie know to get up, its ok we got past the other universe thing, everythings ok now. But the reason why donnie is laughing and doesnt get up is because one of two reasons; because he remebers this dream, not clearly but enough that it makes in think what the hell did i just dream about and laugs because it feels so real and the other reason I cant remeber what he said. It very interesting to watch the commeneted version because it expains everyone and everything.
>>By BbZzDd (Monday, 17 Nov 2003 01:58)
Does Donnie ever really travel back and forth in time. I believe one theory is that he halucinates the following 28 days after the engine lands in his room. Manifesting and seeing his own path he then decides to stay in bed rather than see the destruction of the universe, if Frank is telling the truth at all.
I believe Frank is the devil who defies God's path for Donnie, Frank gives Donnie the option to change his own path, this is briefly said by Kyle the teacher could cause a universal collapse. However, Donnie follows the spear like portals all the way through the film, I believe God knew Donnie would go out of the house the night the engine fell. Frank (the devil did not succeed.) The man in the tracksuit often seen in the background of the film i think is god, he is always there to overlook Donnie's progress to make sure he follows his set path.
>>By Fear/Love (Friday, 21 Nov 2003 16:44)
The guy in the red suit is one of the CIA (isthat the name) Well I know that he is cop of some sort because the director said it in the commentry version of the film
>>By BbZzDd (Monday, 24 Nov 2003 01:31)
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